Charas-Project
Off-Topic => All of all! => Topic started by: A Forgotten Legend on November 16, 2007, 11:50:59 PM
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OK, this is an argument between my friend an me.
afl: I just started to get the element thing
afl: its confusing because it doesn't make common sense.
afl: v.v
augenauf99: with using them on correct enemies?
afl: no, what elements are good against what
augenauf99: actually it does make common sense
afl: otyher elements
afl: ???
afl: other*
augenauf99: "its confusing because it doesn't make common sense"
augenauf99: it makes sense
afl: Whats makes sense about it?
augenauf99: as in Fire<->Ice Lite<->Water?
afl: thunder and water
augenauf99: lightning you dolt
afl: >.>
afl: How is water good against lightning??????
augenauf99: think of what happens when you drop a drink on a computer
afl: And?
augenauf99: your computer (Lightning) DIES
afl: Most games its just lightning>water and then water>fire then fire>ice
augenauf99: then wats good against lite? hmm?
afl: Ah, its usually something like ground or rock
afl: then then ice>rock
augenauf99: which does not exist in ffx
afl: yeah
augenauf99: oh bitch you got jacked bitch
afl: ?
augenauf99: lol
augenauf99: u get my point of y its Fire<->Ice and Lite<->Water?
afl: hold. I'm gonna ask about this to someone who has no clue about the game
augenauf99: u asked zack didnt u?
afl: no
afl: my dad
augenauf99: oh
augenauf99: lol
augenauf99: i assumed zack cuz he just got on
afl: He said water wouldn't do anything to lightning.
augenauf99: and yet think of a computer
augenauf99: it stands no chance (Lightning) against a drink (Water)
afl: But electricity would go right through the water
augenauf99: But the object utilizing it explodes, shorts, or dies
afl: still, its the lightning part of an object in ffx?
afl: is*
augenauf99: u just dont want to listen to the fact that i kno wat im talking about
afl: and if something gets wet, would it attract lightning more than something dry?
augenauf99: and kno it is not
afl: but, it doesn't make sense that water would be good against lightning!
augenauf99: YES IT DOES YOU CONCEDED JACKHOLE
afl: Ok. I'm making a poll on charas
augenauf99: If you still dont grasp the fact that water is good against lightning after i have explained it in the simplest way possible
afl: still, it doesn't make sense.
augenauf99: you are one or both of these things: retarded, stubborn
augenauf99: YES IT DOES
augenauf99: ugh
augenauf99: ill give you examples
augenauf99: lite>water: lite evaporates/splits water
augenauf99: water>lite: water shorts/reroutes lite
augenauf99: fire>ice: fire melts ice
augenauf99: ice>fire: ice puts out fire
afl: argue on charas
What do you think?
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It so makes sense.
hence my example with a computer.
if you need specifications:
Lite>Water: Lightning evaporates/splits water
Water>Lite: Water shorts/reroutes lightning. (Possibly changes the charge)
Plus i should smack you for half of what was copied an pasted ...
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I would never read this. You fail at entertaining me.
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Dude, it's a video game. The element system was built that way as an excuse to make Watera & Wateraga, and to make the game easy.
End topic.
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Pretty logical:
Ice wouldn't do anything against a campfire unless it's a hell load of ice.
And a match wouldn't do anything against a pile of snow since it would die before the snow melts.
Lightning would make an area around where it struck electric for a second but that would just paralyze.
Water would just become smoke from the heat if it touched anything electric.
But in masses. All of those would be effective.
If I drop a snowman on top of a campfire? The flaems will die.
If I burn the snow with a napalm? It will vaporize.
If I drop a pair of wires into a lake? It will light up and fishes will float.
If I drop a bucket of water on something electric? It will probably kill itself.
But yes, water agaisnt lightning isn't that logical but let's say that the monsters only have a certain area on their body that hold electricity if this electricity would be chained to the head? It would take damage from it untill the water pours off. Like if I was using an electric wire to attack and you throw water on me so it links to my chest.
So, no more disscusion about this. Overkilling is the way to go.
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Water cancels Lightning out.
If lightning is going to strike Water, it won't reach the end of the water before it ceases.
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Here is how it works:
Fire>Grass>Water>Fire
Electric>Water>Ground>Eletric
See, those are circles with 3 elements, that will always end up at the first. Water does nothing to electricity, I mean, try to throw water at a pikachu. Nothing will happen. Now, use a thunder shock at a squirtle. It will die. Pokemon is always right.
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Ice does not put out fire. What happens is that the fire melts the ice into water, and then the water puts out the fire. So fire beats ice, but is then immediately beaten itself by the water it has created.
Water wouldn't do anything to lightning. If lightning and water were to meet in equal quantities, lightning would win.
Rubber beats lightning. Which is why we need more latex catsuits in RPGs.
For female characters only, obviously.
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Originally posted by lucas_irineu
Water does nothing to electricity, I mean, try to throw water at a pikachu. Nothing will happen. Now, use a thunder shock at a squirtle. It will die. Pokemon is always right.
This.
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It makes a lot of sense, huge sense to me. All elements have one element that is the opposite for each. Water and lighting/electricity is evident that affect each other, you wouldn't dare to put yer computer in a bathtub full of water, or would you touch a computer wit yer hand wet while it's plugged in, it's just common sense. They react to one another, and that's the basic concept used in games that have elements. If an electrical body was attacked by water, merely a fall of water, it would fry, and not only with water, water like liquids would do the same thing, lighting pretty much reacts to most fluids, if not all. A water body struck by lighting, would electrify itself, if you are wet and touch electricy, you are going to fry faster and worse than if you weren't wet. I don't think I need to explain myself on Fire and Ice (Although, I agree that Ice only puts out fire once it has melted into water, so ice is quite redundant, but I am sure it's added to give the elements a balance), Wind and Earth, I believe they pretty obvious. As long as you are talking about bodies housing each of the elements, it does work very well. In reality lighting hurts everything badly, but we are pretty made out of water ourselves, and lighting most of the time is fatal. Think about it, what would happen if we were mostly made out fire and lighting struck us? Not much for sure, some elements just do not react to one another.
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If we are talking about eletric machines, then yes, water> lightingingonging i'm too ****ing tired to hitbackspace
But we're talking about pure eletrecity. Like, throwing a bucket of water at a lightning would not make the lightning stop, in fact, it would rush through the water and expand. It's not hard to see who's at advantage in here.
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What doesn't make sense in FFX is that water doesn't hurt fire much.
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Originally posted by Grandy
If we are talking about eletric machines, then yes, water> lightingingonging i'm too ****ing tired to hitbackspace
But we're talking about pure eletrecity. Like, throwing a bucket of water at a lightning would not make the lightning stop, in fact, it would rush through the water and expand. It's not hard to see who's at advantage in here.
'
Oh, wait... we are talking about pure electricity? Then I guess I am confused, I thought this was about monsters that hold a certain element as their innate. _sweat_
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There is nothing in the game that is pure electricity. Well that is except for the lightning elemental. however i can explain how that would work with water killing it:
1: the water strikes the elemental
2: the extreme heat and energy splits the water into hydrogen and oxygen
3: what happens to hydrogen when it is exposed to an energy source?
IT EXPLODES!!!!!!!
4: the oxygen then fules the fire
This concludes how water would affect a pure lightning entity
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Originally posted by augenauf99
There is nothing in the game that is pure electricity. Well that is except for the lightning elemental. however i can explain how that would work with water killing it:
1: the water strikes the elemental
2: the extreme heat and energy splits the water into hydrogen and oxygen
3: what happens to hydrogen when it is exposed to an energy source?
IT EXPLODES!!!!!!!
4: the oxygen then fules the fire
This concludes how water would affect a pure lightning entity
Then, again, we are trying to use science here to explain an elemental.
Think about it, en eletric elemtental, it's basically a thunder walking around. It's appears, get discharged through the ground, disappear. Yippee. Free XP and most definetely an overkill.
But seriously, up until now I've seen people talk a lot about how water could kill and eletricity-fueled being. I'm not saying that that's not right, but it's not the beings WEAKNESS. Fire can destroy an computer as well as water does, even an overcharge of eletrecity does it. Nay, I'm concerned about Water being eletrecity's WEAKNESS, not simply damaging it.
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It should be Thunder beats water, water beats fire, fire beats ice, and ice sucks in general. In the earlier FFs, thunder was the dominate power.
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I like it when the elements are like this.
Fire > Ice
Ice > Wind
Wind > Earth
Earth > Thunder
Thunder > Water
Water > Fire
Light > Darkness
Darkness kinda sucks but has the most powerful attacks.
I'll admit the Versus System doesn't make sense in the real world, but it's a FREAKIN VIDEO GAME! How is this getting a serious conversation? It's a Final Fantasy game. It's X, the game that gave us Blitzball and J-Pop Stars for Summoners. Does it really have to make sense?
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Yeah. All we can really do is give our points of view, there will never be an agreement about, evidently. Though, I believe the creators use what would make more sense, given the fact that all elements affect each other as I said in one of my earlier posts. Say, fire can burn a computer yes, not as fast as water thought, and that's what I mean. I personally use the element that destroys the other faster.
Darkness kinda sucks but has the most powerful attacks.
I agree the Dark magics suck in a lot of the games. But I think Darkness is lovely.
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Originally posted by Ganocide_of_a_Kingdom
Yeah. All we can really do is give our points of view, there will never be an agreement about, evidently. Though, I believe the creators use what would make more sense, given the fact that all elements affect each other as I said in one of my earlier posts. Say, fire can burn a computer yes, not as fast as water thought, and that's what I mean. I personally use the element that destroys the other faster.
A lightning bolt destroys a computer faster than water. At least in my mind. I never really tested the theory.
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It might also depends on what kind of water manifestation we are bringing into the picture, I believe. Lighting bolts are one of the strongest and hottest manifestation of electricity (I believe some lighting bolts reaches the temperature of the surface of the Sun (I don't remember where I read this). I would compare a lighting bolt to maybe water to the point where its temperature it's in the edge of freezing but not qiute there yet and with the strength of a fair-sized waterfall.
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The most tragically underpowered element is Gravity. It saddens me that nearly everything is immune to it.
aboutso, please explain to me the logic behind Ice > Wind.
I'm not saying you're wrong or calling you an idiot or anything, I'm just interested as to your reasoning.
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It's an excuse to have every element be equal in strength as far as game design goes and nothing more.
If I had to add something, I would make a wind element monster a collection of particles floating in the air. The concept would be similar to water. The enemy will become a solid object unable to animate and thus killing him.
Of course, this only works if wind monster does not equal a bird.
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But freezing a bird would be quite usefull as well huh? They can't fly anymore and will fall to the ground(and hopefully break the frozen wings).
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True, but in most cases birds are weak to Thunder. Most RPGs just work better if there is a separate set of monster elements like Bird, Reptile, Zombie, etc. in addition to the main ones. Pokemon is just an excellent exception.
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augenauf99... You got upset way too easily in that convo 0_o
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To whoever said the thing about computers and water, energy is made from either coal or water, not lightning.
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Yeah, that might be the case for the source of energy. But that leads to electricity in the end. I'm sure my computer does not run on coal and much less water. I never said the energy that we use daily is made by electricity, that would make no sense.
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If you can power a stargate with lightning, you can power a computer.
On another note, IX > X
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My name is augenauf99 and I like to bitch.
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Water won't do ANYTHING against lightning. Neither vise-versa. When there is a thunderstorm, and then there's a flood. What does lightning do when it hits the ground? Nothing happens. NOTHING happens. Thus, there is no explanation for this weakness and resistance, the reason they probably put it is because of electricity and water. I also hate it when people put thunder, thunder is the sound of lightning. This is also sorta like Pokemon with Psychics and Psychics.
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Lighting and water will affect each other if yer body was made out of one of the two. And yeah, lighting by itself and water by itself, won't do anything to each other.
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Well, now it's impossible to prove. nothing on Earth is made out of the 2. Unless, I shock myself and sparks fly around my body.
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*looks at pool*
yes: 4 people 19%
no: 17 people, 80%
...lol basic math.
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The reason electricity is seen as 'good against water' is that water conducts electricity so people touching water when electricity runs through it get shocked. The water itself is fine though.
And yes, FF9>FF10 so very much.
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FFIX will always be the best final fantasy...
No: making lightning elementals and flans weak against water might not have been the greatest move by enix but they wanted to bring water into the black magic school mainly because of FFXI.
So yeah... Write them a mail and ask, it's great fun actually.
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FFIX will always be the best final fantasy...
No: making lightning elementals and flans weak against water might not have been the greatest move by enix but they wanted to bring water into the black magic school mainly because of FFXI.
So yeah... Write them a mail and ask, it's great fun actually.
I might actually do that. but either way, i've long since forgotten about this and have moved on to an idea of one of my sadistic friends which involves making Holy creatures weak against fire and fire weak against lightning and so on and so forth until the gamer is so confused by the elemental properties it's hilarious. of course it would only be a semi-short flash game. lol
granted for the basis of my argument i was using water more as a catalyst than a magical body of damage. i mean water could destroy armor if put under enough pressure hence pressure-cutters. of course that has nothing to do with lightning heh
I declare this officially dead
KIRBY (^l.l)> lol
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Hey, the thread's been dead for over two years. Please don't do this kind of thing again. Locking.