Charas-Project
Off-Topic => All of all! => Topic started by: Grandy on August 08, 2006, 12:47:17 AM
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Okay, so, have you ever noticed two Final Fantasies were never set in the same world? We have Spira of course, but that's X and X2, which doesn't counts.
But then, there's this theory that I came up with, that all the worlds are actually the same, but in diferent times.
What leads me to think this was mostly FFT. For two reasons:
There are ruins with the same name and references of past Final Fantasies Characters, and in sidequests you can find Materias and such.
And for the main reason, in the Cloud sidequest, notice he appears through a Time Machine, not a Teleporting Device. Which means, he came from a diferent time, not a diferent space.
Now, there is another reason, but I'm not pretty sure: Chrono Trigger. I many times heard Chrono Trigger was part of the Final Fantasy series, and even once or twice it was refered to me as "Final Fantasy Chronicles". I'm not pretty sure about that, but it would make even more sense if it was. In FFT, there this ruin called "Floating Island" where is said that "Mages Used to live". Sounds familliar? Why, it's Kingdom of Zeal!
That would also explain why there was a time machine hidden in a destroyed city, which could be explained as one of the 2300 a.D. ruins, where the Epoch was found. Even though the time machine does not resamble the Epoch in any way, it was never stated in CT that the Epoch was the ONLY time machine.
There were other reasons, but I can't remember right now.
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Well, the problem is that the land masses don't line up. If the same world is the same in each game, the landmasses would have to be simular. True, over time land masses do change, but not that much.
I just think that final fantasy games like to kinda hide refrences to other games in the series from time to time. You see it a lot in FF9. I think they just do this for fun though, and they don't actually mean that the worlds are related.
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This sounds kind of dumb to me. I'm sorry. Don't get mad at me. Square intentionally puts references between their games. FFTactics is a BIG offender.
Go to FFCompendium.com and you'll see what I'm talking about. I can see where you came up with the idea.
I'm making an FFFangame so I do my homework.
EDIT
Why did you BEAT ME HERE?!?!
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I believe the worlds of 7 and 9 coexist for a reason.
When playing as Zidane in the Lindblum weapon shop, push X next to the wall. He will look at the assortment of swords, and look at one saying, "I know a spikey haired guys who uses a sword like this." Or something to that effect. The sword he is looking at is none other than Cloud's Buster Sword.
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About the landmasses, how many times did you play a sequel where the landmasses were exactly the same
And the series never came to an end. I'm almost sure they'll link all the story line, otherwize, there was no point for making it a series.
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Originally posted by Dragoon de Sol
I believe the worlds of 7 and 9 coexist for a reason.
When playing as Zidane in the Lindblum weapon shop, push X next to the wall. He will look at the assortment of swords, and look at one saying, "I know a spikey haired guys who uses a sword like this." Or something to that effect. The sword he is looking at is none other than Cloud's Buster Sword.
FF9 has refrenses to pretty much every FF if you look close enough, thats because when they were making it, they wanted to use a lot of the elements they used in older ff games, thats why they had the crystal and the 4 guardians, garland, etc.
Landmasses do change from game to game, but whole continants and such were added and removed. If they planned to make these games sequals, they wouldn't completely remake the whole world in every game.
The reason they use the ff title is because they use ff elements in every game, chocobos, cid, etc. Plus FF is a big name, just by slapping FF on the title, it gets a big hype and usually good sales.
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The first and the second Final Fantasies didn't had Chocobos. Or moogles. Or Cids.
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Originally posted by Grandy
The first and the second Final Fantasies didn't had Chocobos. Or moogles. Or Cids.
Yeah, but one, three, four, and five, were all about the crystals. I never played through two yet, so I don't know if that deals with the crystals at all, but I'm guessing it would. Originally, thats how the games were related. Though, that idea got old after a while so they had to modify the story a bit and make it more original from game to game. And actually, the crystals in each game always locked something away or whatnot, then they were destroyed, the bad thing released, then killed, if the games were linked, the crystals couldn't have spanned across multiple games unless new ones were created.
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They make past references for the hardcore gamers.
Example, Illusion of Gaia wasn't an FF game, however, in FFT, they make references to the lands and items in the game.
They arn't all of the same world. They are just new games with new worlds. That's what I like about FF, when you pick it up, you don't expect it to be a continuation of the series, like MGS.
And yes, FF2 DID have Cid AND Chocobos. FF1 I think had Cid, but I'm not sure.
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Well...it all depends how technical you want to get.
When first made, I believe FF2 did not have cid or chocobos, but it it did here.
FF2 here is different then FF2 from japan. Now, though, we've but the Final Fantasies in the order Japan has them.
Basically, what we got as FF2 was FF4j, and FF3 here was FF6j.
As I said though, we've put them with their correct names.
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I'm a nerd. I've played every single final fantasy game out there. Including FF3 for NES. You'll have to follow this logic.
With FF1, they were on the verge of bankurptcy (GOD KNOWS I SPELLED THAT WRONG). They just needed sales. They created the choose your own party system, and put on a decent storyline. It sold!
FF2, they were pretty much competing with Dragon Quest. They actually made a storyline. They put in a build your own playing style of game.
Here's where the chocobos and stuff come in. They needed mascots (Again to comepete). This is when they started to use Cid. The moogles were there as "beavers." Their main mascot was the Onion Knight.
FF4, this is pretty much where all Final Fantasys come from. The deep-yet-corny storyline, the Active Battle System, the Chocobos, the moogles, etc. are all here. FF9 took a lot of ideas from this game. That is why FF9 is my favorite. FF9 almost followed the bible of Final Fantasy to a T.
If you really want the same world, Ivalice appears in FFTactics, FFTA, and FF12. It even uses the same geographical features like DragonBlaze was talking about.
BTW, I might be off on the information above. Can someone correct me?
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I'm talking about DoS FF2.
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As for land masses, I blame Bahamut. Too many kabooms. Messed with the dirt.
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I think that instead of giving the Final Fantasies numbers, they should give them different titles. It won't give people the idea that it's a sequel. I don't like it when everyone who hasn't played or heard of FF asks if it is a long sequel.
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Originally posted by I Have a Sandwich
As for land masses, I blame Bahamut. Too many kabooms. Messed with the dirt.
I can agree with that :p
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Actually, the person who wrote the scripts for Final Fantasy VII - X-2 (Maybe VI...) Claimed that Final Fantasy VII and X were directly connected by story...
This sums it up...
Shinra, the name of the little genious in Final Fantasy X-2, claimed he discovered a new energy source by drawing energy from the Farplane using Machina, Which is the same method used in Final Fantasy VII that the company called Shinra uses to suck Mako out of the Lifestream.
The suggestion is that The inhabitants from Spira drained all the life out of Spira, then moved on to the world of Final Fantasy VII (Gaea I believe.) Where they met the Ancients (The Cetra, the race Aeris belonged to.) And began to suck the life out of the planet there....
Oh, and IX has refrences to just about every Final Fantasy... And even Starwars...
By the way, this isn't a theroy, the guy who actually wrote the scripts and stories for the series, came out and said this.
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You know 8 bit comics? In one of those "write to red mage" things, someone once sent in a theory about the chronological order of FF1 through 10. It was pretty good.
Also, a theory is that when Cloud feel into the lifestream, he went into FFT. After he left that, he washed up on the shores of FF7 land again. Or something.
Also, in FF7 they reference Xenogears (or saga), around the same part, when Cloud is sick and in a wheel chair.
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Originally posted by Razor
Also, in FF7 they reference Xenogears (or saga), around the same part, when Cloud is sick and in a wheel chair.
Explain, as I'm not that far into FF7 (my friend can't find disk 3 and I'm stuck on disk 2 [ok, I'm not stuck, I lack incentive]) and I've never played any of the Xeno games... Yet...
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You control Tifa at the time, when you find him in in Mideel he says something on the lines of "zeenugiaahs" or something phonetically similar.
Oh, and Aeris dies.
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Originally posted by Meiscool
FF1 I think had Cid, but I'm not sure.
Cid is only mentionned in FF1, by the Lufenian.
Originally posted by aboutasoandthis
FF4, this is pretty much where all Final Fantasys come from. The deep-yet-corny storyline, the Active Battle System, the Chocobos, the moogles, etc. are all here.
There's no Moogles in FF4. You probably confused them with Namingways.
I don't think FF worlds are the same in different time... Like DragonBlaze said, the land change too much. Too many things change... they only put reference for... I don't know... in FF1 ( DoS ) in Elfeim, there's a grave where you can read ''Here lies Link'' and... it is sure not related to Zelda.
On other hand, in Zelda ( first ), Adventure of Link, A Link to the Past and Ocarina of time, it is always Hyrule... but the lands are all different... Uhm...
Oh and... in FF7, Caith Sith dies too, but he resurrect... kind of...
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No, no. Reeve controls Cait Sith from Shinra HQ. He just made the first Cait Sith figure out the puzzle to get the black materia, crushing himself in the process. Then Reeve sent in another Cait Sith and everything worked out Milhouse.
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Originally posted by SonicChaos7
I think that instead of giving the Final Fantasies numbers, they should give them different titles. It won't give people the idea that it's a sequel. I don't like it when everyone who hasn't played or heard of FF asks if it is a long sequel.
XD!
You guys are horrible, lol.
Everyone loves FF, so they're just making it original and yet unoriginal at the same time. Take the best parts of FF and adding it to the newer game. I like the idea, they should so make a "FF Celes will kick your ass!" game.
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In FF6, there was this other "plane" where the espers came from. Espers were the summons. Then in FFX, the smmoners interact witht he farplane to summon creatures to aid in battle. it could pretty well be that the farplane is actually the place where the Espers lived.
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Actually, there are a few planets in the series, but they don't really interconnect (unless direct sequels). Ivalice (FFt, FFt:advanced, FFXII), Spirea (FFX and X-2) and the one they said for VII.
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I'm going to bet that... Squenix is going to explain the relationship between the FF games, probably through another FF game. Probably something to have to do with the elemental crystals (materia/magicite/spheres = lesser crystals, there was a crystal in FF9, and they'll retcon it to have crystals in FF8 and 2j) or Cid (they're all the same person), or possibly some outlandish new character who can travel through spacetime (explain Chrono's relation to FF)
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As for the landmass thing.......
With all of the cataclysmic events ravaging the world, all of the Horrible disasters, all of the summoned God-Beasts, and All of the Underground Rivers and such, A rapidly changing Landscape like that of the planet in Question is not out of the question.
ALSO....
Another theory....
With all of the space travel involved in these societies, Could it then be possible that there are Pioneers travelling about a cluster of plantes....Nay, not planets.
Moons.
Im pretty sure the final fantasy worlds are clusters of moons orbiting a gasseous giant of a planet, Eminating solar energy off of a reflective Surface, giving the Illusion of sunlight.
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Originally posted by gemini
As for the landmass thing.......
With all of the cataclysmic events ravaging the world, all of the Horrible disasters, all of the summoned God-Beasts, and All of the Underground Rivers and such, A rapidly changing Landscape like that of the planet in Question is not out of the question.
ALSO....
Another theory....
With all of the space travel involved in these societies, Could it then be possible that there are Pioneers travelling about a cluster of plantes....Nay, not planets.
Moons.
Im pretty sure the final fantasy worlds are clusters of moons orbiting a gasseous giant of a planet, Eminating solar energy off of a reflective Surface, giving the Illusion of sunlight.
The only problem with that is that the worlds themselves have moons. The moon in FF8 played a big role. So unless they're moons with smaller moons, I doubt that.
Besides Ivalace and spira, there are gaia and terra. And terra is just another name for the earth. Terra was the main planet it FF9, but Gaia was also in FF9. I believe Gaia was the name of planets in other games of the FF series.
And really, differant people write diffearnt FF plots. If someone made a plot for two games, then yeah, maybe they added little things that would connect them a bit. But if two diffearnt people wrote two differant games, they're not going to make them connected to each other.
As for FF6 and FF10 in the farplane and summons. That doesn't prove anything. FF4 or 5 (one of the two, I forgot which one) also had a seperate world for the summons. But guess what, so does hurculeas, does that mean that its a part of the FF series? Summons are meant to be powerful beings kinda like mini-gods, in almost EVERY game, story, myth, legend, movie, imortals live in a differant realm. So if multiple games in the ff series have that, it doesn't mean squat. I don't know the story of FFX very well, but aren't the summons in that games basically 'dreams'? And these dreams only staretd 1000 years ago when zanarkand was destroyed or something like that, so, unless all the games with summons happened within those 1000 years, the summons wouldn't be present in other games, but then if the games did happen in those 1000 years, sin would have been in all of them.
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Originally posted by Dragon Blaze
Besides Ivalace and spira, there are gaia and terra. And terra is just another name for the earth. Terra was the main planet it FF9, but Gaia was also in FF9. I believe Gaia was the name of planets in other games of the FF series.
No, actually Gaia was the main planet of FFIX. The lesser one is Terra, which was home to the souless people, and the town Bran Bal. I think you had the two mixed up.... Oh well, no harm done... They both had identical moons as well...
Oh and the flow of souls is the same as in Final Fantasy VII, if you think about it... Concidering that the mist that inhabbitants Gaia before you stop the Iifa tree, is truely just a mass of souls, that are supposed to return to the earth, but are instead absorbed to Terra, to return life to their planet and citizens. Kind of like how Make is changed to energy..
Which is also alot like Final Fantasy X's feinds, which are just souls of people who dispise the living...
If you think about it, they are all really connected in some way...
Espers from FFVI are the souls of monsters trapt is stone, who give power to those trying to bring justice.. In FFX, the Fayth are those who are trapt in stone, that give their power to summoners..
Spheres are practically the same as Materia... Look at macalania woods, where you fight the master sphere beast... Auron claims that spheres are created by the fountain where you fight the Master sphere, which looks an aweful lot like the Mako Fountain in FFVII, which is the source of Materia.. Plus both are used to enhance your characters... Stats and magic.
FFIX has refrences to just about every single other one... In Lindblum, there is old man Named Locke. There is a weapon called Kainslance. There is a shop in Lindblum (I think...) where you see a Sword and Zidane claims he knew a spikey haired man who used to use a large sword... (Which someone else already pointed out...) The four Chaos guardians are Lich, Kraken, Tiamat and Maliris (Which was originally Kary... But they look identical...) Which are the same as the Guardians in FFI. Same with Garland.
Oh, speaking of Garland... I WILL KNOCK YOU ALL DOWN!
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But the four gaurdians were killed in FF1, they were also killed in FF9, and they were also killed in whatever other games they appeared in. If you think about it, FF1 and FF9 can't go together. In 1, garland is kinda caught in a cycle, the heros kill him in the present and the past, they killed the gaurdians that braught him back. In 9, garland is from a differant planet, he was made to look out for that planet, the guardians in 9 fight for the other planet.
So unless terra resurrected the evil gaurdians and garland, it wouldn't work.
Plus, in FF8, at the end, doesn't the sorcerous mearge the past, present, and future together? If that happened, the characters, cities, things from other FF games would show up when this happens.
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I'm just gonna stick with the fact that they have comepletely different storylines.
I DO believe however that certain groups of Square-Enix games have connections, just for references. Usually through those who character design or write different stories.
The Ivalice world has it's own language and it's own calender as part of a culture called Vandelia. Vandelia is the country from Vagrant Story, and you can learn to read the language in both Vagrant Story and FFTactics. Like Meis said, these games have references to IofG and the Ogre Battle Games.
I forgot his name, but who designs the Kingdom Hearts games throws references all over the place. The Bouncer had a lot of Final Fantasy References and could somewhat workout as a side story of FF7 (you'd have to REALLY force the storyline in). Dogstreet pops up in different games. The man even admitted he based Sora's character design on Sion from "The Bouncer."
This part is kind of off subject but could someone explain "The Lunarians" in FF9? In FF4, they were like sleeping moon people weren't they? I couldn't understand that part at all...
I just know they built Necron, the Final Boss.
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Originally posted by Midnight
Everyone loves FF
OMG FALS STATMNT
I agree on waht sonic says. some ppl who do not like the series or do not know about it think of all of them as being one sequel right after another.
However squareenix did not want to spend more money trademarking whole titles than just numbered titles. or whatever the reason was.
THere ARE some connections. Some of these which I am not willing to talk about cause I am generally should be a haater of the whole FF realm 8D though i did "like" ff8.
I always gived it they were different dimensions and time frames, with all the same crap of summons and monsters.
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FF9 included a lot of hidden references, not to connect the games in any way, but just for fanbase value as it was the last FF for Ps1. I mean, the story you compile for Ramuh is about your deeds in FF2 (getting the Goddess Bell from the Adamantoise), and you'd then have to argue that FF2 used the same world, which it clearly didn't.
I think re-using the Guardians and Garland was merely for fan value, just like the FF7 Rufus's Parade tune was used in the crashed Theatre Ship in the Evil Forest. Zidane referring to Cloud's Buster Sword is just another of those references I feel.
Many Final Fantasies use similar ideas (World of Espers in FF6, World of Summons in FF4 and Farplane in FF10), but this does not necessarily point to any direct connection between the games.
So yeah, to summarise, I think the references are just included for fun rather than to link the two (or more) games.
And yes, I've played every single Final Fantasy and beaten everything in all of them besides the NES FF3 (and that's because I can't find it anywhere :()
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Dunno. But hey, I said it was just a theory.
And "Gaia" is also only another name for 'Earth'.
Now, something just occured to me, what about reincarnations? It has been said that many FF characters have the same name, it'd be possible the they're the same person who died and were reborn? Like, all the Cids?
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Well, reincarnations could be possible. All the cids pretty much have something to do with airships and are geniouses. The problem with this is that parents are the ones who name people, so if a person is a reincarnation of cid, its highly unlikely that they'll still have the cid name. I think its just another element they put in every FF game.
Kinda like Ryu from Breath of Fire, looks the same in every game, can transform into a dragon in every game, falls in love with nina in every game, but he's actually a differant person in every game. But without ryu, the game wouldn't be a breath of fire game.
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The first BoF didn't have Nina.
That aside, reality was never a part of those games, and having the same name as your past life is a big cliché, so yes, it could happen.
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Originally posted by Grandy
The first BoF didn't have Nina.
Uh, yeah, actually it did.
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Apex is right, it did.
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Originally posted by Grandy
The first BoF didn't have Nina.
That aside, reality was never a part of those games, and having the same name as your past life is a big cliché, so yes, it could happen.
Well considering none of the cids really have memories of the other cids, and a lot of them have completely differant personalities (thinks of cid in FF7 compared to cid in FF9), they're pretty crappy reincarnations. But I guess if they have the same name, and are good with airships, they MUST be reincarnations of eachother...
Cid is just another element from Final Fantasy just like chocobos, the crystals, moogles, etc.
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Don't forget Biggs and Wedge.. (I guess Biggs is sometimes Vicks.)
Oh and just about 70% of the weapons are reused...
Masumune
Ragnarok
Ultima Weapon (Atma.)
And so on...
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Or you could just say FF9 was not canon at all.
Or perhaps Zidane knew a spikey haired man called Jeremy Robinson who happened to use a sword similiar to that of Cloud's?
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Well considering FF9 and FF7 were in two differant time periods, its kinda doubtful that Zidane knew Cloud. And Cloud couldn't go through a time mechine like he did in FFT because there wasn't any such technology in FF9.
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We never know how Cloud got back home from FFT, then he could very well have ended there by accident at some point, bringing the time machine with him.
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I like to think that after advent children, cloud got stuck in ivalice and never returned. Meanwhile, sephy comes back and easily destoys the planet.
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^ Owned.
How about this? All of the FF's are different planets, not really connected with each other (excluding Compilation of FF7, FFX/2, and the games on Ivalice, of course), but they do have a common thread - a race of humanoids from some unspecified source (perhaps another of the FF worlds) has colonized them all and passed down parts of their cultures and such. Or, perhaps the colonists used crystals (or, in the case of Chrono, Lavos) to give planets the capacity for life, then colonized them and passed down their cultures to the descendants.
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Originally posted by Warxe_PhoenixBlade
^ Owned.
How about this? All of the FF's are different planets, not really connected with each other (excluding Compilation of FF7, FFX/2, and the games on Ivalice, of course), but they do have a common thread - a race of humanoids from some unspecified source (perhaps another of the FF worlds) has colonized them all and passed down parts of their cultures and such. Or, perhaps the colonists used crystals (or, in the case of Chrono, Lavos) to give planets the capacity for life, then colonized them and passed down their cultures to the descendants.
I can agree with that.
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How about the idea of parallel universes?
FF9 rox...