Charas-Project
Off-Topic => All of all! => Topic started by: drenrin2120 on April 24, 2010, 05:38:12 AM
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Yeah,do it.
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Obamanation. RAGE.
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*walks away quietly*
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Right.
OBAMA AIN'T 'MERICAN! HE'S SOME FOE-REIN-ERR!
And I'm done.
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Should soulless robots be able to handle kittens?
(http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Pages/Everyone%20Else/images/stephen-harper-kitten.jpg)
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He's gonna eat it.
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This is why I am not proud of being Quebecer.
(http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c216/cerebus_x01/charest.png)
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I should go quote the giant sign that is right across the street from my house.
Or go take pictures of it.
Angry Conservative-Republican signs are hilarious.
Especially when the people who word the sign don't know grammar.
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Seriously, you dont even want me to post pics of ralph klein or ed stelmach
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American Politics is funny. You don't ever get along. In sweden we all get along but bitch about what the other parties are doing. But we never do anything about it.
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He's gonna eat it.
NOT THE KITTY! D=
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Gordon Brown! Gordon Brown!
Gordon Brown is going down!
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Kind of a side note, but the other day Freddie asked me if I knew who Professor Layton is. I thought he meant this guy:
(http://www.usc.uwo.ca/clubs/opss/jack%20layton.jpg)
(Jack Layton, Leader of the NDP, Professor of Economics at Ryerson)
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I don't care enough (or at all) about America to pay attention to the politics, let alone bitch, moan, or get mad about them.
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Seriously, you dont even want me to post pics of ralph klein or ed stelmach
(http://images.theglobeandmail.com/archives/RTGAM/images/20040505/walber0505/0505klein_done2.jpg)
Ralph Klein is scary looking.
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I don't care enough (or at all) about America to pay attention to the politics, let alone bitch, moan, or get mad about them.
No one specified this was American politics.
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No one specified this was American politics.
I was just mentioning I don't care about the country that I live in enough to care about its politics.
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Kind of a side note, but the other day Freddie asked me if I knew who Professor Layton is. I thought he meant this guy:
(http://www.usc.uwo.ca/clubs/opss/jack%20layton.jpg)
(Jack Layton, Leader of the NDP, Professor of Economics at Ryerson)
*headdesk*
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Nobody can agree on anything important in USA: We're all gonna die.
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Nobody can agree on anything important in USA: We're all gonna die.
So true. You could also say: Republicans are unflinchingly non bi-partisan. The two are more or less synonymous.
I also concede that I'm extremely biased, probably ill-informed and love Jon Stewart.
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Nobody can agree on anything important in USA: We're all gonna die.
Technically... they can agree on the fact that they're all gonna die. Just not how.
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I'm very anti-war, and honestly at the moment I'm pissed off that the whole "pull troops out of Iraq!" promise actually translates to "put them in Afghanistan instead! Wahoo!"
Way to go, doofus I voted for. You're better than that other doofus who ran, but not by much.
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He can't. He doesn't want to piss off republicans so that he can get reelected. Or so I hope.
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It really is a tricky situation. Bush really fucked things up, so we should be happy with whatever we can get. At least we have a legitimate reason for being in Afghanistan (sorta).
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Obama is a politician, so you can't expect him to get everything he promised done. You also can't say the guy isn't doing anything. He's tackling a lot of things at once. And in spite of what most conservatives I've heard say about the health care bill and other more liberal things Obama is doing and pushing for, I think it'd be unfair to say he's not at least trying to be bipartisan. The only example I can think of is, last I heard, he was considering more oil drilling off America's coasts and maybe even signed a bill? Not too sure on that. But as far as I know, that's a pretty big thing for republicans.
The Iraq and Afghanistan wars are real messy. There's a lot of resistance against them for a lot of very different reasons. I personally lean more towards the view of the wars being for profit and extremist conservative views, those being: spread of christian beliefs and the annihilation of Muslim religion. The more accepted reason is terrorism and the need to be rid of the world of terrorism (which is a foolish, overly simplified look at a very complex problem), and the removal of weapons of mass destruction and blah blah, we all know. I'm not denying terrorism is a threat, but fighting terrorism with war is like trying to removing a bee hive with another bee hive, fighting fire with fire, beating a rock with another rock... you're not gonna get very far before one, the other, or both break.
I'm really straying from the point... Uh... troops in Afghanistan. Yeah, what I'm saying is I don't like it either, but I'm not mad at Obama.
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I like the idea of throwing a bee hive at bees to make them go away.
It's delightfully anti-progress.
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I'm very anti-war, and honestly at the moment I'm pissed off that the whole "pull troops out of Iraq!" promise actually translates to "put them in Afghanistan instead! Wahoo!"
Way to go, doofus I voted for. You're better than that other doofus who ran, but not by much.
He can't just pull them out, though. There would be extreme consequences. If you send troops somewhere, topple the government, start reworking the political structure, cause a lot of violence that most people can't really understand, and then you just leave, you're going to have a country full of people you did terrible stuff to and that you never made up for. The sad thing is, unless there's a miracle and somehow the country starts being self-sufficient and safe, America can probably never leave, since leaving looks like giving up. It'll just create more terrorists in the country since it'll create a generation of people who were fucked over by America then left to dry.
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Bush Jr. apparently still isn't considered as bad of a president as Warren Harding was. Yet.
EDIT: Nevermind. A 2008 poll has him in 37th while Harding is in 33rd. Congratulations, Bush. You've outdone a historical figure that was famous for his poor presidential term. That's probably only because they only had to put up with Harding for 2 years. We were stuck with ya and your genius administration for 8.
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Is he polled as doing worse than that guy after lincoln?
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I like the idea of throwing a bee hive at bees to make them go away.
It's delightfully anti-progress.
Congress?
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Congress?
I'd throw a beehive full with bees at the congress.
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ANd here I thought this was a serious thread.
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So, I heard from my teacher that Obama is trying to pass a bill that will make a year of community service required.
Naturally, the class erupted into a whole "Obama more like OSAMA!!!" thing because of that.
Redneck schools are fun.
Also, I completely disagree with this.
Shorten the period, and maybe we'll talk.
EDIT: Also, how 'bout that Arizona **** going on?
Yeah...dick move, Arizona.
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Yeah, what's happening in AZ is crap. They gave police the power to approach any Latino with no good reason other than them being Latino, and ask for proof of legality.
For me, that's like allowing the police to approach a black guy and ask them if they have stolen anything recently, just cause they're black.
Although I understand the latter in a way has been allowed under suspicion and that's it, the objectivity and discrimination in the former indeed riles up trouble and inconvenience.
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By The Time I Get To Arizona...
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What are you guys saying is happening? How can that possibly be legal? That sounds similar to the treatment of Chinese people with the head tax and citizenship papers up to the beginning of the 20th century...I thought we were past this.
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As far as what I've read and understand, Arizona passed a law allowing Police to pull over, or arrest anyone who does not have a valid ID, birth certificate or other means identifying them as a legal American citizen. There's also a part that allows the citizens of a town or city to sue their local law enforcement if they feel that the police are not enforcing this law harshly enough.
Putting the discrimination factor aside as one thing, the other thing is it's like Arizona completely ignored the fact that there are legal Mexicans working, attending colleges, and traveling in the U.S.
I know Mexico's got their issues, but paranoia over immigration and discrimination toward Mexicans and Mexico's competency as a country is outrageous.
I say we make it easier for people to immigrate to America. Closing our borders is ridiculous. There's plenty of land in America that could be developed, plenty of smart people from Mexico that could start businesses and create jobs. They're not gonna come here and steal all our jobs away. We've already lost half our jobs to China and India. Plus, by allowing immigrants to become citizens more easily, we'd be forcing companies and business owners to stop using illegal immigrants like ****ing slaves.
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Gotta love the US.
Nothing beats having paranoid/dumb rednecks controlling the masses.
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Definitely, we can't just disappear. "Oh hey guys! Isn't democracy COOL?! Yeah! Have fun with it. Bye now."
Doesn't really work. Then again there's that whole bit of overkill-- toppling a government of an already unstable country to take out a small extremist group-- that's always a great way to handle things. Not that Saddam should've stayed in power, but America has really no right to go in and /decide/ that. It's one thing to encourage an ongoing rebellion or revolution, but this approach of spoon-fed democracy has been proven many times to be ineffective.
There's never going to be "victory" or "completion" over there. It's eerily like Vietnam in that respect. Replace "communism" with "terrorists" and you're good to go.
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Kind of makes me think of what would happen if the civil war had not been won.
I'd imagine the confederacy would be based on slavery, segregation, oil mining, and fail if it still existed. Of course, if it did, that means archem, valiere, ZKX, and I would be kind of in a weird spot.
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As far as what I've read and understand, Arizona passed a law allowing Police to pull over, or arrest anyone who does not have a valid ID, birth certificate or other means identifying them as a legal American citizen. There's also a part that allows the citizens of a town or city to sue their local law enforcement if they feel that the police are not enforcing this law harshly enough.
Putting the discrimination factor aside as one thing, the other thing is it's like Arizona completely ignored the fact that there are legal Mexicans working, attending colleges, and traveling in the U.S.
I know Mexico's got their issues, but paranoia over immigration and discrimination toward Mexicans and Mexico's competency as a country is outrageous.
I say we make it easier for people to immigrate to America. Closing our borders is ridiculous. There's plenty of land in America that could be developed, plenty of smart people from Mexico that could start businesses and create jobs. They're not gonna come here and steal all our jobs away. We've already lost half our jobs to China and India. Plus, by allowing immigrants to become citizens more easily, we'd be forcing companies and business owners to stop using illegal immigrants like ****ing slaves.
Yeah man.
It isn't just mexicans but other Latino's as well. I had friends that are Cuban in AZ, and I've recently known that they were pulled over just because they were Latino.
It's stupid. Ignorant, and let's face it, racist.
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ITT people act like racial profiling is only happening in AZ
At least here in canada the federal police (rcmp/mounties) dont sugar coat the fact that they profile. They admit to it quite openly.
And allthough it may be immoral, and wrong...it gets result
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Countries have the right to enforce their borders. The fact is that a lot of southern states have a huge problem with illegal immigrants that work illegally off the books. Workers don't have to pay income taxes and companies don't have to pay insurance other taxes for having employers. It's against a huge number of laws, mostly involving tax laws. You and your parents pay higher taxes because illegal immigrants aren't paying anything at all. It's a bit of a cruel law in Arizona, but if an area that's losing the battle against illegal immigration, it makes a lot of sense.
I say we make it easier for people to immigrate to America. Closing our borders is ridiculous. There's plenty of land in America that could be developed, plenty of smart people from Mexico that could start businesses and create jobs. They're not gonna come here and steal all our jobs away. We've already lost half our jobs to China and India. Plus, by allowing immigrants to become citizens more easily, we'd be forcing companies and business owners to stop using illegal immigrants like ****ing slaves.
There is so much wrong with this that it sort of hurts, but basically:
1) the border isn't closed; people are just cheating the system because it's less expensive for them
2) American citizens make a lot more money than the average in other countries, such as Mexico, thus the illegal border crossings in the first place. Illegal immigrants don't want to settle new land and start businesses; they generally want to make a quick buck under the radar because it's more than they can make at home. Basically, yeah, they DO want to steal our jobs away
3) We're still in a recession; there aren't enough jobs for actual Americans right now across the board. Shouldn't be so willing to just give them away to immigrants.
4) Having an open border with Mexico wouldn't change the fact that more and more companies are outsourcing to countries like India to go after cheaper labor. If anything, it would speed up the process because Mexico is also a closer option for outsourcing that's still pretty close to US borders. So the US would lose additional market share in this instance.
5) Companies don't outsource to China because they want the cheap labor. They do it because a certain percentage of things sold in China need to be MADE in China and it's a country with a billion people, so it's worth going after the market share by building factories there. Fairly brilliant on China's part actually. Their economy will either overtake ours very soon or has already, depending on who you ask.
It's stupid. Ignorant, and let's face it, racist.
It's only one of those things - racist. It is, unfortunately. But it neither stupid nor ignorant. It would be stupid and ignorant to allow illegal immigrants to cheat the law the way they do. They are the ones crossing the border illegally to make money because American dollars are worth more and they're doing it without paying taxes. In no way is this acceptable and it's high time someone came up with a practical way to discourage the practice. I do feel bad for the actual legal citizens of the area that have to go through the hassle of being ID checked a lot, but sometimes there are solutions to problems where not everyone wins. They could always move up north farther from the border if they don't want the association.
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I agree that countries have a right to do this, in fact I support that they do their best to get illegal immigrants out. But this is not how you go about it. If it's okay to do something racist because the law allows it, then this is no longer something smart, I don't know how it can be. There are more other methods in which this can be combated. What's pissing me off is not so much the idea of trying to get illegal immigrants out; that's indeed fine and well under the law. But automatically assuming I am illegal because I look Latino is unjustified and again, racist.
This is simply, not the way. I can easily in the future see the abusing power of police in some areas. Like the one I lived in before; 90% of Police officers ALREADY pulled you over for being Latino and on top mocked you cause of it. This isn't smart. It just isn't.
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He can't just pull them out, though. There would be extreme consequences. If you send troops somewhere, topple the government, start reworking the political structure, cause a lot of violence that most people can't really understand, and then you just leave, you're going to have a country full of people you did terrible stuff to and that you never made up for. The sad thing is, unless there's a miracle and somehow the country starts being self-sufficient and safe, America can probably never leave, since leaving looks like giving up. It'll just create more terrorists in the country since it'll create a generation of people who were fucked over by America then left to dry.
This is correct. I've read a few articles by people that did reporting in Iraq, and the general consensus seems to be that the second we pull out, the factions are going to rip each other apart. If I recall correctly, Obama does have a time frame for withdrawing from Iraq. But there's no way of knowing how long it's really going to take for Iraq to be stable. It's really a damned-if-you-do-damned-if-you-don't situation...and the only thing I can say is we wouldn't be in this mess if we'd never gone there to begin with. As a consequence, if it devolves into civil war, expect the right's attack dogs to tear into Obama for it, when it should never have been his problem in the first place.
And Phayre, remember that Afghanistan is a different ballgame than Iraq and always has been. Politicians across the spectrum generally supported invading Afghanistan, our allies supported invading Afghanistan. Iraq is where Bush overstepped. Presently, I hear the Taliban is making a bit of a comeback there, so maybe our work isn't entirely done.
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Dude Arizona has a right to have tough immigration laws. I think some people might want it because they are racist but not all. I'm one of the only mexicans I know that's against illegal imigration. Opening up the boarders is an extremly dumb idea, especialy since the drug cartels are crossing the boarder and are apparently killing U.S citizens. I heard on the radio someone from one of the cartels shot an old man and his dog why they where going for a walk. Racial profiling sounds pretty good now.
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Dude Arizona has a right to have tough immigration laws. I think some people might want it because they are racist but not all. I'm one of the only mexicans I know that's against illegal imigration. Opening up the boarders is an extremly dumb idea, especialy since the drug cartels are crossing the boarder and are apparently killing U.S citizens. I heard on the radio someone from one of the cartels shot an old man and his dog why they where going for a walk. Racial profiling sounds pretty good now.
I am Mexican and I am all for the taking the illegal aliens out. Believe mme; back in high school I did this thing on it and was hated by the people who didn't understand. But this is not the way to do it. This will not only affect illegals, but it will also make some trouble for those that ARE legal. And that's my nuisance.
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And I'm the third Fellow of Hispanic Origin.
We should form a band.
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I got a little carried away when I was typing. Illegal Immigration is one debate, the law Arizona passed is another, and THAT law is still highly discriminatory. I agree with everything HTML said. But I still think something has to be done so companies can't benefit from cheap labor. The more I think about it, the more I realize this is something I should read into.
I didn't know a certain percentage of things sold in China must be made in China. I'm pretty sure the U.S. doesn't have anything like that? Even if we did, would that be beneficial for us?
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The world succeed after invading Germany the second time, but lord. They failed miserably with both Afghanistan and Iraq.
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I didn't know a certain percentage of things sold in China must be made in China. I'm pretty sure the U.S. doesn't have anything like that? Even if we did, would that be beneficial for us?
I don't know, but it'd be interesting to see whether conservatives would side with patriotism in favor of it or against it because it's "big government meddling in the free market."
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I didn't know a certain percentage of things sold in China must be made in China. I'm pretty sure the U.S. doesn't have anything like that? Even if we did, would that be beneficial for us?
We don't. We have import taxes instead, like most countries, to encourage building plants on American soil to avoid having to pay extra taxes.
And I think it's probably impossible to implement something like that in the US at this stage. We import a LOT of stuff. Companies would lose huge huge business from importing if this sort of law was passed, not to mention people like you and me would lose a fair amount of cool stuff.
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Countries have the right to enforce their borders. The fact is that a lot of southern states have a huge problem with illegal immigrants that work illegally off the books. Workers don't have to pay income taxes and companies don't have to pay insurance other taxes for having employers. It's against a huge number of laws, mostly involving tax laws. You and your parents pay higher taxes because illegal immigrants aren't paying anything at all. It's a bit of a cruel law in Arizona, but if an area that's losing the battle against illegal immigration, it makes a lot of sense.
Some things to remember about illegal immigrants:
A: They are freaking impovershed. They're illegal immigrants, literally running their *** across that border with next to nothing on their back, going to a new nation where everyone hates them pretty much. When they arrive, they usually have to end up living in sheds or holes in the ground in big canyons. And you know what? They somehow survive on like $1.25 per week somehow. Which I can't even comprehend, given the price of foods. What would you tax them for?
B: They're doing a lot of work you'd probably not want to do. If you got rid of immigrants, your sons and daughters would most likely have to become avocado farmers, factory workers, or something. Thanks to their race, they'll be making perhaps a bit more than the illegal immigrants, but that's also a bit of an economic burden on the landowners, yes? Illegal immigrants are willing to work harder and ask less questions about their jobs for a much lower price, which has its ups and downs; mainly ups for US economy on the whole and downs for the immigrants themselves, namely in terms of health-care and family.
Here's a fun factoid - If the US wanted to completely close the border to illegal immigrants, they could do it within a day. So why don't they? Pretty much for the reasons I stated above; they're cheap labor that seemingly don't mind their low status. And while it might seem unethical at face value for them to be working under such crappy conditions, the conditions are actually worse back in Central America and Mexico, with hard jobs not even earning enough to make a living, and especially in Central America, political strife causing problems with the law and drafts with immigrants from those locations. With all this in mind, hardly any illegal immigrant is crossing the border to pick a fight or avoid taxation. They're trying to make a living in a nation that's mantra is practically "Home of the Brave, and Land of the Free".
Granted, the source for most of this information is coming from a study of illegal immigrants crossing over from Mexico and Central America to San Diego, but I can't imagine it being much different further down the border. If anything, given the less liberal position that Arizona has in comparison to California, as well as their recent crackdown on these Immigrants, I'd guess that they're worse off in Arizona than in San Diego.