Charas-Project
Off-Topic => All of all! => Topic started by: daoman89 on July 14, 2013, 03:30:59 AM
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With Windwaker coming out late October and A Link Between Worlds a day before my birthday, it's a good year for zelda fans with the disappointment of Zelda Wii-U remaining a mystery. Whether or not a sneak peak at the HD game will happen sometime this year is a mystery as well. Of course Miyamoto said that they'd tease it early NEXT year if WW sells good, but that's just mean. Show us some of the damn game!
I will be one of those people purchasing WW again because 1... it's my favorite zelda game with SS in #2 and 2) I plan on getting all the heart pieces this time... Should be easier with the boat turbo.
Next we have A Link Between Worlds. I'm surprisingly not super hype about it yet, probably due to the fact that there's still only a tiny bit of details about it. We have no trailer depicting a plot or anything such as a sneak peak at a NEW dungeon. I'm curious as to why Link is wielding the Master Sword again when at the end of ALttP it says the damn sword will sleep foreva.
Now back to Zelda U. I understand them not revealing the game at E3 because they believed that showing it off would distract people from the other games, so it kinda makes sense I guess. I can't wait to see the art direction they're taking and what its story will be about. I loved the writing in SS, Ghirahim had some awesome quotes such as 'making your ears bleed with your own screams' or his personal attacks towards Link. He was a dick which was cool.
I'm sure I am not the only one looking forward to some upcoming Zelda and I'm sure there's some of you who just don't care. We do have both Oracle games to hold us (not me cause I beat them) until the others come out. Surprisingly, they don't seem to be that popular yet. Both of them were amazing games, upgraded versions of the GB classic LA. The only thing they didn't trump LA on was their stories. Link's Awakening had a much deeper story than those two. I really hope those things get the attention they deserve.
My favorite zelda story however is... Majora's Mask. Why? Because it was dark and the thought of everyone dying in 3 days made me want to save their asses. Plus the way the 5 stages of grief were placed within each of the 5 areas (clock town, denial. swamp, anger. snow mountain, bargaining. ocean, depression and whatchamacallit, acceptance and death) It was a story of Link healing the lands from these griefs and in the process growing up himself. Other characters had their own role and everything was just great.
That's enough of me chattering away, what are your thoughts on anything about the zelda series? Go nuts! :D
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I love the series and await anything they have to offer with bated breath.
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I have a love/hate relationship with The Legend of Zelda games. If you look at (most of) the individual games, they're absolutely amazing. Though looking at the games together, most of them follow the same basic format. I think of Zelda as the first 5 final fantasy games where they all had the same basic plot with different directions. After playing most of the Zelda games, I'm kinda sick of going to the 4-8 dungeons, getting the new equipment, and fighting ganon/ganondorf. I felt like skyward sword was a step in the right direction, but I feel like they need to reimagine the base game mechanics to really make the series great, at least for us long term fans.
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I disagree. I feel that the reason any particular Zelda game can be seen as something really amazing is because the mechanics are tried-and-true, something that has every reason to be a central part of the games, and has been honed to a razor's edge by this point. Honestly, improving the stories with the games is the only way I can see a real improvement being made. Actually, perhaps a step backwards might be the way to go. The dungeons have lost their charm a little bit by not properly integrating the world around it into its own sub-dungeon the way they used to, and the dungeons themselves might be a little too streamlined. Making them complex and deep made them more confusing, but it also made them feel more like a place where you could get lost (in a good way). Most importantly, making the boss fights more complex (more than one pattern, multiple possible weaknesses, reacting to repeated abuse of weaknesses, and perhaps even a health bar in place of the traditional 3-hit system) could really help make the confrontations more exciting and memorable. I would like to see the dungeons made into something that fits more into the fiction than "abandoned cave filled with crazy puzzles for no reason", like abandoned villages, Moblin prisons, or magic castles in the sky with an undead king as the boss. They'll never be perfectly sensical, but at least they'll have a reason for existing. Leave the rest of the game alone, and things will be great.
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I've always thought that OOT is an amazing game, but when I replayed it again on the 3DS I kinda realized that it's pretty simple. Battlewise mostly at least. Gohma died in like 8 seconds, poor thing.
My greatest problem with Skyward sword is the dungeons, they are very linear in a really bad way. The previous games a had a bunch of going back and using that one thing you found in the cave, hidden stuff that you can get by bombing the right position and stuff like that. It was simply impossible to "get lost" in skyward sword and that's a shame.
I felt that twilight princess was a worthy game in the series, it had everything I expected. Horse, large world, a super annoying water temple and sidequests.
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I think the only way they could improve Zelda is by making it 2D again, then putting all their dev work into more items!
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I'll keep it short because I have the unpopular opinion here.
1) I like Zelda games for the sheer fun they have.
2) They have been getting stale. I don't look forward to one anymore.
3) The general series is average.
4) The stories are bland. It's the same format over and over, but don't get me wrong. They serve the purpose they were written for. It's not a game which selling point is the story. But please, don't tell me it has a great story because it does not. It has a decent bland video game story.
5) Remake? Seriously? You think it's a great Zelda year because of another remake?
For the tl;dr: Zelda is meh, it good mindless fun but it's way overhyped.
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I guess each to their own, Dr. Ace :p I'll agree with you on story though. The story is VERY generic, but they just seem to drag
it out, do long panning shots and add orchestral music to make it seem more... "epic"?
However, you must have played LoZ: A Link To The Past! That is just something else, and it's dated surprisingly well!
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Like Drace, I kinda play Zelda for the fun and not for the story . Like how I play super mario bros, I do know that the princess is kindapped and will not be in the next castle, as it have been for the last 50 years or so but the gameplay and level design weights up for it.
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Nobody said "great" year for zelda. It's a 'good' year because of the rerelease of the oracle games, remake of WW and we get a brand new zelda.
The stories in the games are pretty simple and generic, but some of the games have deep meanings if you look into it, like Majora's Mask. And another example is the Ancient Cistern dungeon in Skyward Sword which referenced some old story, you'd have to google that ish. But like everyone basically said, you shouldn't expect a great story in which RPGs are suppose to have.
I agree with the linear dungeons in SS. They shouldn't make them so damn linear. I mean, some were cool like the ship, but overall they were lacking in exploration. Twilight Princess would've been better if enemies did more damage and the bosses actually put up a decent fight. And as for both, STOP TELLING US AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN WHAT ITEM WE PICKED UP!!!
Zelda does need a change, but too much change will make it 'not zelda'.
Determining whether or not the series is under or overrated is a matter of opinion and tastes. I think CoD is overrated, but that's mostly because I couldn't care less about it. I don't wanna play a realistic game, i wanna be taken away from this hellish earth. I'd say all the popular series deserve the praise they get. Each game has its own unique effects on people.
Just don't start playing a game expecting something great or bad to what you've been hearing because all that matters is if you enjoy it. Don't be that guy that starts off a game and purposely tries to pick out problems. This is why I don't like watching reviews anymore because some of the things people pick on is retarded.
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I think CoD is overrated, but that's mostly because I couldn't care less about it. I don't wanna play a realistic game, i wanna be taken away from this hellish earth.
I want people to stop calling Call of Duty realistic. The games are Hollywood action at its finest; practically a Quake game with a different skin (and the same engine :p).
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I don't see how people can call Call of Duty realistic.
Being able to survive multiple bullets by waiting a few seconds between each shot, but dying from a knife strike on the tip of your toe isn't what I would call realistic. That and many, many other things.
Like how a simple infantry soldier can call a nuclear strike on their exact position even if they are winning the fight.
It's just not realistic in the slightest. Like, at all. None. It's not.
I play Zelda games because I like the gameplay. I don't really care about the story because, as mentioned, it's the same thing over and over.
Most newer Zelda don't appeal to me. I hope this new one will be good. It's in 2D, so it's already interesting. I also hope it contains at least 8 dungeons. Perhaps they'll even reach the 12-13 that A Link to the Past had.
We'll see. We'll see...
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I think he meant realistic as in "it touches the conflicts of modern everyday life" in contrast to unrealistic "unicorns and puppies singing songs about how duke nukem destroyed the death star"
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I think he meant realistic as in "it touches the conflicts of modern everyday life" in contrast to unrealistic "unicorns and puppies singing songs about how duke nukem destroyed the death star"
Purp hit the nail on the head lol. I know it's not real real life, but its played with realistic type things not like fantasy things that take more imagination to create.
It's my fault for not being more specific :P
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Oh, that kind of realism, I see. Makes sense.
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I'll keep it short because I have the unpopular opinion here.
1) I like Zelda games for the sheer fun they have.
2) They have been getting stale. I don't look forward to one anymore.
3) The general series is average.
4) The stories are bland. It's the same format over and over, but don't get me wrong. They serve the purpose they were written for. It's not a game which selling point is the story. But please, don't tell me it has a great story because it does not. It has a decent bland video game story.
5) Remake? Seriously? You think it's a great Zelda year because of another remake?
For the tl;dr: Zelda is meh, it good mindless fun but it's way overhyped.
This is pretty much exactly my opinion. I haven't played any since buying (and not finishing) twilight. Just not really anything to get excited about anymore I feel.
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Oh, that kind of realism, I see. Makes sense.
At least we got that topic out of the way though, right? hahaha
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While the Zelda series generally is thin on plot and heavy on gameplay (did the first or second games even have plots?), I think that ALttP, Majora's Mask, and WW all had good and more in-depth premises than other Zelda games. I loved the Oracles games, but being randomly pulled out of Hyrule to solve some other people's problems is not the way I want to start my day. In fact that's a great way to piss me off, when the world wakes up on the wrong side of my bed, and I'm a morning person, for God's sake. Whereas in MM, your quest starts with your search for your missing horse(?) (if I remember, it's been a few years since I've had the opportunity to play it) so it starts with an instant emotional backdrop set by Epona's absence (I'm pretty sure.) WW is pretty much a post-apocalypse scenario a la Cloud Atlas, and you're Tom Hanks before shit gets heavy. And ALttP... well, I just really like that one the most because it reminds me of my grandparents' home-away-from-home-and-I-don't-have-to-deal-with-family-issues-here basement, and I won't apologize.
Sidebar: I think I should write game reviews.
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(did the first or second games even have plots?)
Yes.
Yes they did.
(the backstory and stuff was in the manual)
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I'm pretty sure you had a horse in MM but searched for your little fairy friend Navi who totally ditched link once he saved the world.
Then Skull kid appears and steal your horse and turn you into a cool deku.
(the backstory and stuff was in the manual)
Like FFXIII, although the manual is a thing reached from the game menu.
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he nv finds Navi... That bitch up and left. Probably held a grudge for that 7 year long wait and when it was finally over she said, **** you Link, im out! Can you really blame her though? Did Link ever care about her feelings? No, he ignored her all the time. The hero of time was a selfish douche! It even shows in MM. He gets super cocky and starts flipping over gaps. I bet none of you put yourselves in her shoes! She lost over 7 years of her life, 99% of which Link was knocked out. Idk their lifespan, but i doubt it's long. Shes lucky Link didn't shove her *** in one of those bottles. Link, she left you because you're a natural dick, plain and simple! She led you to Termina for karma. Payback's a bitch, aint it!?
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Must've been horrible, watched her kin being trapped in bottles and consumed while she was made to watch.
Also trying to get Link to actually save the world when he just sat around doing fishing or chasing cucus or spending time at the archery range. And when she pointed it out he just kept doing those sidequests like she never existed.
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Not interested in a WW remake. The original WW wasn't that great. It was okay enough to tide me over (har har pun) but had too much sailing and not enough dungeon delving. And there was only one dungeon I reallllly liked (the undead one with the bird chick). As we all saw in the OoT remake, they didn't add jack **** to the game, so I wouldn't expect anything new out of the WW one either.
A Link Between Worlds is a different story though. That's NOT a remake, but a sequel, and a sequel in one of my favorite Zelda settings. The SNES game was far more heavily involved in exploration and weird items and dungeoning, and, like Like's Awakening, it's a style that Zelda has moved away from, with the Oracle games sort of being the last hurrah. So I'm interested in seeing if they've still got what it takes to make that type of game where the graphics can't carry it and the story doesn't matter, so the gameplay better be solid.
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Didn't they add some sort of boss-fightning mode to OOT and made the master quest mirrored?
Not that it might count for something , but it's there.
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Didn't they add some sort of boss-fightning mode to OOT and made the master quest mirrored?
Not that it might count for something , but it's there.
They did, but I agree with SaiKar how they could've added more details maybe even a bonus dungeon. Perhaps put more enemies on the damn field. It was still great though.
I heard ALBW is very smooth, but it feels different. ALttP, LA and Oracles were 2D zelda at its finest. Minish Cap was good too, it just needed more dungeons lol. I would've liked PH and ST more if they allowed me to use the damn dual pad and buttons. ST was definitely better than PH for me, but they both lacked in ways. Like the ice town in ST was so poorly designed and looked awful. ST was really fun though.
And I bet Navi led the skullkid to Majora's Mask. Just to **** with Link... That evil, vengeful chattering fairy!
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What bothers me in a Zelda game: the opening sequences just keeping getting longer and longer and less involved. I have played Zelda before, I know what to expect, give me my sword and point me to the nearest dungeon. I don't want 3-5 hours of exposition before I get my fourth heart, I wanna play Zelda damn it.
Twilight Princess despite being better than I originally gave it credit for, has an opening that will keep me from ever starting it again, and Skyward Sword got about 30 minutes of my time before I realize that I was never actually going to get into the meat of the game and be perpetually stuck in the limbo of generic Zelda story telling.
I swear, if I have to watch how the three goddesses created the planet and Triforce one more time in OoT, I'll never start that game up again.
I'm not a retro-only clenched butthole, but damn do I miss the older Zelda games when you wake up in a bed get your shield and travel 7 screens before you get your sword and unleash hell.
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I miss bird-eye view with side-scrolling maps. I miss having 8+ dungeons. I miss square-shaped World map.
I don't mind waiting a bit before "real action" starts. I'd just rather have it retro-styled.
I also prefer "Young" Link.
This new Zelda game looks promising, but I'll wait before making a judgement. If it contains like 4 dungeons I probably won't bother trying it.
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The creators know we want lots a dungeons and stuff. I agree they should start the intros with more action than running around. I didn't mind SS beginning because exploring the town was fun, but TP was a lil boring. Maybe they should send Link through a mini dungeon to teach you the ropes. WW's beginning was short so it worked and **** went down within like 15-30 minutes depending on your exploration tolerance.
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I... Actually agree with the mini-dungeon for tutorial purposes. I usually dislike those, but if done well, I can see it being nice. I'm thinking that it would be something of a cold open like the 007 films typically do. Unrelated dungeon crawling with no connection to the story, immediate drop into the action, finish it up, bad-*** intro sequence commences. Maybe treat it similarly to Super Mario World where there are tips that you can ignore if you already know what you're doing. As for explaining how link got into things, they could do a number of things. Make the intro somewhat surreal and call it a (day)dream, use a fake-out art-style and have it be revealed to be a story or something, or even have the dungeon itself be a flash-forward where you come back at a later point in the game, but with context. There are a lot of ways to put it in and not mess with the "unsuspecting hero" thing they like so much.
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Maybe Link needs to rescue a friend who's on a high cliff, but the original path has been destroyed so he needs to improvise.
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Yeah. There are lots of ways to go about the idea. I was lost in the deep-end of the pool, but your shallow-end approach works just as well, and fits pretty well.
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Oracle of Seasons and Ages did it well. I mean the story for Zelda has been practically the same every time. We don't need to be retold the story every time. It's not the exploration of the first area that bothers me, it's the long, boring, and unskippable cut scenes. I don't think I'm the only one who doesn't play Zelda for the story.
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The classic 90s intro still lives. Like Dune, that intro was like 3 minutes of a head talking about the state of the universe. Of course it is a film, but you wouldn't see that today - for a sound reason.
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Xenoblade Chronicles intro did it well. Opened up with **** going down. I personally liked SS's lil painting intro. it was neat. All zelda stories are basically going to be the same cause Link has to end up saving something or someone, what they should do is make the meaty stuff in the middle to get there more interesting.
The point of zelda is to make the player feel like the hero. Like you're the one putting an end to everything bad. By the end, it should have you thinking... "Wow, I went through a lot of **** to get here!". Skyward Sword made me feel like a BAMF because I was the only human going through hell the most. Sure Zelda did too, but she didn't have nothing on me! The moment that Demise told me he was impressed how brave I was for a human, I knew I had to prove myself to take him out! In our hearts, we wanted to fight this dude at his full power just to let him know who he's fuckin' with!
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Might as well list my zeldas from favorite to least favorite. And no hating on my opinion lol
1. The Wind Waker
2. Skyward Sword
3. Ocarina of Time
4. Twilight Princess
5. Oracle of Seasons & Ages (they have to go together)
6. A Link to the Past
7. Majora's Mask
8. Link's Awakening
9. Minish Cap
10. Spirit Tracks
11. Four Swords Adventures
12. Four Swords
13. Legend of Zelda
14. Phantom Hourglass
15. Adventure of Link
Pending: A Link Between Worlds, Zelda U
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My best to worst:
Link's Awakening
A Link to the Past
Ocarina of Time
Majora's Mask
The Wind Waker
Twilight Princess
Four Swords Adventures
I have not played them all, clearly. And, just looking at that and realizing this literally on the spot, that sure does look like the release order of the games. I guess each new one impacted me a little less. It was a little less exciting to get the bow, to do the forest dungeon, to find out that there was nothing really all that valuable to buy with rupees.
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Preference order, uh?
Mine would looks something like this:
A Link to the Past
Oracles
Link's Awakening
Ocarina of Time
The Legend of Zelda
Zelda II
I'm excluding both Four Swords because they're quite different since they were mainly for multiplayer, although if I recall, Four Swords Adventure was a bit m ore similar to others. They'd probably be somewhere under Ocarina of Time on the list order.
The rest I either haven't played enough or at all.
I did play a bit of Wind Waker and Majora's Mask, but I didn't like them. One has too much sailing and the other is just plain annoying to play. Both have something in common, though: very few dungeons.
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I don't see how this is really relevant to the discussion, but whatever.
!. A Link to the Past
2. Twilight Princess (yes really)
3. Link's Awakening
4. Oracle of Ages
5. Wind Waker
6. Ocarina of Time
7. Oracle of Seasons
8. Minish Cap
9. The Legend of Zelda (NES)
10. The Legend of Zelda: Spirit Tracks
I don't think I need to list past ten. To clarify, I didn't put Skyward Sword or Majora's Mask on the list because I haven't played enough of either to have a strong opinion about them. At some point I might revise the list, but as of now they're unplayed. I also didn't really count the Four Swords of Four Swords Adventures games because they were both more like multiplayer spin-offs than actual games, and don't really qualify. If I felt they did, a few games would be bumped down on that list. Phantom Hourglass wasn't on the list because I stopped at ten. Zelda II is somewhere in the realm of the Philips CDi games as far as I'm concerned.
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Since we're all doing it:
1. Link's Awakening
2. Link to the Past
3. Majora's Mask
4. Wind Waker
5. Legend of Zelda
6. Ocarina of Time
7. Twilight Princess
8. Oracle of Seasons (Not Ages, I never beat that one, the third dungeon into is too boring.)
9. Adventure's of Link
Gross: Phantom Hour Glass.
Didn't play or beat the rest
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My favourite is Wind Waker, but I don't feel like organizing it into a list because blah.
I also enjoyed LoZII and am really enjoying Awakening.
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There is no "The Legend of Zelda II". It's only "Zelda II". Get the name right!
Just beat Link's Awakening again today. I still don't see how exactly it's any positive. I mean... good luck getting back on land, pal!
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Just beat Link's Awakening again today. I still don't see how exactly it's any positive. I mean... good luck getting back on land, pal!
Hey, at least he isn't going to die in a comatose dream.
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He drowns until the next Link is born.
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One thing I also liked about OOT was that we got to see some of the political workings of Hyrule and neighboring regions, mainly with the Gerudo. It gave it a little extra intrigue as we saw an outside force infiltrating and manipulating the inner courts of Hyrule.
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Next one begins with the birth of the next Hero.
The parents notice the resemblance to all the legends, and he's thrust into the role almost immediately, training from a young age to be the very best.
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Just beat Link's Awakening again today. I still don't see how exactly it's any positive. I mean... good luck getting back on land, pal!
I like to think the Wind Fish would help him out, seeing as its apparently super powered and grateful for being awoken.
training from a young age to be the very best.
Perhaps he'll be like no one ever was.
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I like to think the Wind Fish would help him out, seeing as its apparently super powered and grateful for being awoken.
Perhaps he'll be like no one ever was.
Nah, the Wind Fish is an ungrateful dick. And you totally took my pokemon theme song reference lol. I was just about to post that!
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Gonna be honest, I think Skyward Sword was my favorite. It seemed like it was the birth of Link and the Master Sword, and kinda gave extra meaning to the rest of the series. I was a little disappointed at first that there were only three main areas, but it was nice to see those areas evolve and change over time. Plus I felt like a badass swinging the sword around killing baddies.
OOC is a very close second because the world was so rich and on top of that, you got to see the change between the present and the future (or present and the past?).
Third would be Twilight Princess just because I thought it was a pretty neat game mechanic, and Minda was probably the most kick *** side kick, especially when compared to the typical faeries...
Then probably it would be Majoras Mask, I really liked the mask system, and the whole "the world will end in three days" thing was pretty sweet, especially when you could play versions of the song of time to make it go slower, faster, or reset it. I feel like Lightning Returns FFXIII is stealing that idea, but will probably fail miserably with it just like it failed with FFXIII-2 by trying to make it sort of like Chrono Trigger.
Wind Waker was ok, the back story was better than most, and the whole "open ocean" thing was pretty cool, but it never really hooked me, and I felt like it was pretty lacking.
From there, A link to the past would probably be next. At the time it came out, I'm sure it was one of the best games out there, but I don't think it had much of a plot, and now a days, I'm not a big fan of adventuring for the sake of adventuring. I want a good story to come along with my hard work.
I've played some more of the Zelda games, but the rest were pretty unmemorable. I haven't played any of the gameboy games though, mainly because I'd rather play a game on my TV or computer instead of a tiny screen.
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I didn't wanna play MM when i was a kid cause I didn't wanna be rushed in a zelda game, but about... 10 years later i understood the mechanic more. Plus I loved looking up and seeing my doom. The moon has that "I'm coming for you mofos!" face on it the entire time.
The reason SS didn't make my top 1 was due to the lacking of fun side quests and the sky didn't offer much exploration. WW's islands usually had something more to offer than SS's islands. The motion controls worked very well (not on a smaller tv I learned though). When people say they're unresponsive I just think they're trying to swing like a dumbass or are too damn lazy to move. "I just wanna move my fingers, my arm can't lift .1 pounds." They could've made some enemies look less retarded, but that's just me.